WEBVTT 00:00.000 --> 00:13.280 OK, welcome, everyone. Next up, we have Manuel, who's going to talk about the solo project. 00:13.280 --> 00:14.640 Man, over to you. 00:14.640 --> 00:20.120 Yeah, thank you. OK, so thank you for having me here. Thank you for organizing a world platform. 00:20.120 --> 00:28.080 Track at four of them. I mean, the world platform now is full of open source, so it's the perfect place to be there. 00:28.080 --> 00:33.680 So, yeah, I'm going to talk about servo project and the impact on the world platform ecosystem, 00:33.680 --> 00:40.720 just a quick introduction. In myself, I'm an old rego, I work at Arigalia, part of the world platform team, 00:40.720 --> 00:46.480 and working, yeah, I was working as a engineering, chromium work kit, implementing CSS features, 00:46.480 --> 00:53.360 and other HTML features and the like. And since 2023, I'm the chair of the servo 00:53.520 --> 00:57.440 technicalist in committee and help me to coordinate the fourths around the project. 00:58.800 --> 01:04.880 Avodigalia is the third talk. Maybe it's a lot of basically an upper source consultancy. We work 01:04.880 --> 01:09.840 in all the web engines and we are top contributors there, and we also have a flat structure that kind of 01:09.840 --> 01:17.200 a cooperative. So, servo, I guess a lot of you have here about it. Here, right, I hope. And you know, 01:17.200 --> 01:21.760 the project that are even some servo contributors in the room. So, yeah, you can talk to any 01:21.760 --> 01:29.040 fast later. So, basically, a word is a web rendering engine, we think in Rust, that's a very 01:29.040 --> 01:37.520 quick summary, basically. It has a bunch of features. It's a incredible, in the sense, it has 01:37.520 --> 01:43.600 a web view API. We are working on it. It has a few features, thank you, to the Rust programming language, 01:43.600 --> 01:49.760 like memory safety and parallel lens. From the beginning, it was tried to use concurrency as much 01:49.760 --> 01:55.760 as possible for for some for everything, basically. And it's cross platform. We could not really 01:55.760 --> 02:03.120 support like five platforms, like three desktop main ones, like Linux Windows and Mac, and then we also 02:03.120 --> 02:08.880 support Android and Open Harmony on mobile. And it's modular. It has a lot of libraries, which are 02:08.880 --> 02:15.360 called crazy on the Rust world that are used by many popular Rust projects and all that. So, 02:15.360 --> 02:20.320 I need to have modules that we use with Firefox, I will tell more about that later. And it's also 02:20.320 --> 02:26.800 a independent project. It's under Linux Foundation, Europe, umbrella. And it's govern with Open 02:26.800 --> 02:35.120 Governance by the TSC committee and all that. So, yeah, independent from from the actors. So, yeah, 02:35.120 --> 02:39.680 like you saw the quick videos, better to explain this. We are seeing here the Serpocial, 02:39.680 --> 02:44.080 which is like the minimal browser we have to test. Serpo, while we are developing on it, 02:44.640 --> 02:50.640 is nothing special, nothing fancy, just to help us test in the project. Here is gross in the 02:50.640 --> 02:55.520 server. The door website, I'm using that icon on the right corner, which is a bit. 02:55.520 --> 02:59.920 Then, the RUS may be, it's experimental features that I'm enabling. So, we can also browse 03:00.560 --> 03:06.240 more complex sites, like GitHub and others, it enables some features that we are still working on them. 03:06.960 --> 03:12.960 And, yeah, basically, like any other webbending, it can render different pages. It's of course, 03:12.960 --> 03:18.880 still many glitches here and there. We'll find some things that doesn't work. As expected, 03:18.880 --> 03:25.200 but the heat kind of of work, it can do a bunch of things. We are having some new features every 03:25.520 --> 03:30.240 day. I mean, there are a lot of work on the project. There are new features that are landing. 03:30.240 --> 03:38.160 And we have just recently landed, like, window, multiple windows support. That's what I'm showing here. 03:38.160 --> 03:44.000 So, you can have even different windows running and things kind of work. You can even play chess. 03:44.000 --> 03:49.360 No, that's something new. It wasn't possible a while ago. So, you can, you can spend some time on 03:49.440 --> 03:56.960 it even playing. And, it also works. I mean, playing very well, of course. 03:58.800 --> 04:03.200 And, yeah, I mean, probably you will know that a little bit about the history of service was 04:03.200 --> 04:12.960 started by Mozilla in 2012. And then, after several years of development, there, in 2020, the whole 04:12.960 --> 04:18.960 team at Mozilla was laid off, basically. So, we can see here a clear impact on the evolution. This 04:19.120 --> 04:26.240 is showing like the PR's Merget. And, per year on the project, we turn off from both, basically, 04:26.240 --> 04:31.360 the PR's from real people, because we have some both that are to make some things. And then, 04:31.360 --> 04:35.280 the average contributors per month, in the red line, and the average contributors per month, 04:35.280 --> 04:40.320 that have no more than 10 PR's that month, the yellow line. And we see that there were a couple of 04:40.320 --> 04:46.160 years, Mozilla kind of, yeah, transition the project to Linux Foundation. And there was a couple of years 04:46.160 --> 04:53.280 that probably were kind of surviving, basically, of mostly that. And, since 2023, you got to 04:53.280 --> 04:58.880 cover the project maintenance. And, the main goal was to bring the project back to life, reactivate 04:58.880 --> 05:05.680 the community, and make it active again. And, since we are managing to do it, I mean, we are now 05:06.240 --> 05:12.800 having way more contributors than before. And, also, a lot of active contributors every month, 05:12.880 --> 05:17.680 which is very nice. And, at least, we have like four or five people here in the room working on 05:17.680 --> 05:25.360 servo these days. So, just focusing on this last period that we were working on, there were 05:25.360 --> 05:30.400 a lot of teams happening and it's impossible to describe them all. You know, we call that, you know, 05:30.400 --> 05:37.440 we talk, but basically, the yellow tending was a very big piece, because in 2020, the Mozilla team was 05:37.440 --> 05:42.960 starting a new layout ending, actually, for servo. And, we took that one and implemented 05:42.960 --> 05:47.120 teams, I flowed, stable, flexbox, so many, many different teams there. There are a lot of 05:48.400 --> 05:54.640 people working on different features, gamepad API, web XR, streams, webcript API, web driver, 05:54.640 --> 05:58.800 I mean, a lot of things like, we have so many contributors, people picked different teams. 05:58.800 --> 06:02.880 There will be a API, we have been working on it a lot. We have a experience also, Sarigali, 06:02.880 --> 06:07.920 with the WPA API that Mario was explaining, and the taking that experience, we are also trying to 06:07.920 --> 06:13.920 make the servo API good. We bring back that tools to life. Now, you can also use them to 06:14.480 --> 06:20.320 to spare servo and each of these VG support and many other things. And on plans, there are also 06:20.320 --> 06:26.240 a lot of plans, a lot of things coming. So, some initial accessibility support, we expect to land 06:26.240 --> 06:31.760 it this year. We want to complete the web API to something that we consider is more or less okay, 06:31.840 --> 06:36.240 or more or less minimal, that people can start to use servo. For real, in their project, 06:36.960 --> 06:41.920 we want to focus a lot on performance, service expected to be fast, and we wanted to be really fast. 06:43.120 --> 06:49.520 We are improving interaction, forums, you can have select things, we want to add selection, 06:49.520 --> 06:53.920 invite that that are not possible yet. More layout improvement, more CSS features, 06:53.920 --> 07:00.960 HTML features, all that. I mean, a lot of things are coming. Just another example, this is a 07:01.280 --> 07:06.560 demo of how you can use a web driver with servo. You can run servo with this. Come online 07:06.560 --> 07:13.040 argument that is specified. A port and then just connect to it. This is a Node.js library 07:13.040 --> 07:20.800 called web driver. Io, you just connect to it, a local host here, and just open hacker news, for 07:20.800 --> 07:26.320 example. So, in this video, I mean, I'm running that, but I run it as a bit longer as 07:26.320 --> 07:34.240 clear that goes to hacker news, and then goes to the search box, enter servo, search for servo, 07:34.240 --> 07:41.920 order by date, and gives you like the last thing, thing, entries about servo there. So, 07:41.920 --> 07:47.520 something you can do pretty easily with, I mean, with servo or with a language, but yeah, with this API, 07:47.520 --> 07:53.040 that is now. We also use in our web driver for running the WLPT test, and that's also very, 07:53.360 --> 07:59.120 nice because that's why the rest are doing also. And yeah, in the last few months that are having 07:59.120 --> 08:03.360 a lot of new projects, you see in servo that are showing up, that's very exciting for us, 08:03.360 --> 08:07.600 and very interesting, because that's why, I mean, the main purpose of the project is to become 08:07.600 --> 08:13.360 something people can use, and then there was a new class here before talking about the Apache 08:13.360 --> 08:19.200 Cordova plugin, that you service a web view, it's still, I mean, most of them are basically 08:19.200 --> 08:24.800 spamming, and it's still experimental, but it's good to see them. Showing up, this beaver browser, 08:24.800 --> 08:30.400 it's something from last night's main directly, and actually we had a half a name, and last night 08:30.400 --> 08:35.040 we decided maybe beaver, because what was the icon, the person to think it was decided, 08:35.040 --> 08:39.600 and it's a good browser that you say it's the mail to the whole UI, I will show a video later, 08:39.600 --> 08:45.760 it's really cool. Servo GDK, I'm like GDK, and by then for use in servo, 08:45.760 --> 08:50.880 it's lean, it also has now experiment, it's in servo underneath, and Paul is a liware mark 08:50.880 --> 08:56.880 down beware, that is part of a bigger project called Marko, so Marko Paulo, and then Marko is 08:56.880 --> 09:01.600 a mark down editor, that you can use, and they have now a branch that also use servo underneath, 09:01.600 --> 09:07.280 so, yeah, you can go to this page, they make with page on the website, and find more examples, 09:07.920 --> 09:14.720 and this is this HTML browser, that last night when I get to the hotel after dinner, 09:15.200 --> 09:20.480 I saw the message on solid, this is the chat we use, that was saying, okay, I have this really 09:20.480 --> 09:26.240 now, and then I was building it, and recording it, because it's really cool, everything is HTML, 09:26.240 --> 09:33.440 you have tabs, you can display the views, and everything is HTML running on top of servo, 09:33.440 --> 09:38.960 and showing what servo can do these days, of course, I mean, something very new, it has a lot 09:39.680 --> 09:47.440 glitches and whatever, but that is cool, you can have this split view, there are different tabs, 09:48.240 --> 09:55.680 and even the older UI is made on HTML and all that, so this is like the settings, but everything is 09:55.680 --> 10:02.640 HTML, you can switch the theme, and I mean, really cool things you can already do with servo, 10:03.040 --> 10:12.320 so, yeah, now the main topic of the toll somehow, like the impact of servo on the web platform 10:12.320 --> 10:17.760 ecosystem, and maybe the first thing is even more than the web platform ecosystem alone, 10:17.760 --> 10:24.160 that I mean, it's not that servo created Rust, but basically Modzilla started the Rust language, 10:24.800 --> 10:30.480 and then the servo project in parallel, and use in service kind of a, if we can build a web engine, 10:30.480 --> 10:35.840 then the language is good, right? I mean, not picking as small example, so just going, 10:37.840 --> 10:43.600 trying to validate faster as a good language by developing a whole web engine, and then on the first 10:43.600 --> 10:50.160 years, the needs of servo kind of help to or influence the design of the Rust programming language, 10:50.160 --> 10:55.360 so this is, I mean, not application of servo, but I mean, but on the whole software community at 10:55.440 --> 10:59.440 the end, and the work community is more and more used in service, Rust is days, 11:00.000 --> 11:04.960 there are a lot of servo crates that I was mentioning before that are very popular, and many, 11:06.480 --> 11:12.640 many servo libraries use these days, many Rust libraries use these days, 11:12.640 --> 11:18.800 I mean, Rust URL HTML55, I mean, many things, if you need, in order application to access some 11:18.800 --> 11:23.840 some web content you are going to probably use, some of these crates that were created by 11:23.840 --> 11:30.480 servo, and also, yeah, to the point that now this day's programming is moving called to Rust, 11:30.480 --> 11:36.640 like all the fonts, code, and all that is moving to Rust with these new fontations libraries, 11:36.640 --> 11:42.480 and all that, so it's like, at the end, Rust is going to be very important for the web platform as 11:42.480 --> 11:50.480 a whole. It also has impact on new web engines, showing that it is possible to write a new 11:50.560 --> 11:55.360 web engine from scratch, like we were seeing, like the web engines that we use these days, 11:55.360 --> 12:02.560 come from like 30 years ago or more, I mean, they come from very old codevases, and all that, 12:02.560 --> 12:09.280 they are like mid-dinners that have been here forever, and at the end, it looked like it was impossible 12:09.280 --> 12:15.280 to do something like that from scratch, and servo kind of demonstrated that was a possibility, 12:15.280 --> 12:20.640 of course, is complex to reach the level of party with the others, but still is a possibility, 12:20.640 --> 12:26.560 and then since then more new web engines have been appearing and all that, and the thing is that, 12:26.560 --> 12:31.520 most of them follow similar principles to what servo was doing since the beginning, 12:31.520 --> 12:36.560 that is basically trying to be as close as possible to the spectrum inology and 12:36.560 --> 12:42.960 the structure and all that, because when you are implementing a web feature, I mean, the spec 12:42.960 --> 12:48.560 has a text that if you also implementation in the different engines, maybe it's not very close to, 12:49.120 --> 12:54.080 and the idea here was try to be as close as possible, so it's easier when there is a back in the 12:54.080 --> 12:59.680 spec, it's easier to fix it in server, because they call try to follow the spec as much as possible, 12:59.680 --> 13:06.240 and also the terms of the things are the same, so that's easier to identify. And then, 13:06.240 --> 13:11.600 yeah, it provided a lot of room for innovation and new things, like servo from the beginning, 13:11.600 --> 13:17.040 was thought to take advantage of the new market architectures that are all multi-core, 13:17.040 --> 13:23.840 and instead of in single-thread, like the regular web engines, it was multi-core from the beginning, 13:23.840 --> 13:28.000 trying to explore that as much as possible, at all the levels, to the point that the layout 13:28.000 --> 13:33.760 engine that was originally designed, that uses parallelings a lot, had to be discarded after 13:33.760 --> 13:39.360 seven years or so, because it was like impossible to implement CSS with doing parallelings for 13:39.360 --> 13:44.400 everything, and now we have in the situation where we can use parallelings for some parts, 13:44.400 --> 13:51.120 but at some point when you get some flows or some things, you need to stop that in that part or whatever, 13:51.120 --> 13:56.320 so trying to explore the limits, a lot of experimentation, new ways to implement 13:56.320 --> 14:02.640 features like CSS and all that, and identify gaps or potential improvements and things like that, 14:02.640 --> 14:11.440 so that's also very, very useful in general. Then, of course, with Firefox, there was a very good 14:11.440 --> 14:16.320 synergies, of course, they are both projects I must see initially, and they share a lot of 14:16.320 --> 14:24.320 components after the work on servo to develop all these libraries, on Rust, they decided to move 14:24.320 --> 14:29.680 some of them to Firefox, and be adopted by Firefox, and they are used these days, and yeah, 14:29.680 --> 14:36.240 that was, I mean, these Firefox quantum projects that they were doing a few years ago, and basically 14:36.240 --> 14:41.760 there are a lot of modules, yes, CSS partners, select or style or web render that are shared by both, 14:41.760 --> 14:47.200 they will think here is that both projects contribute to them, so if servo improves something on web 14:47.200 --> 14:51.760 render, five of will get benefit from it, if five of them improve, several of the same, 14:51.760 --> 14:58.160 so it's very useful that both projects are sharing this and getting, seeing it and all that, 14:59.120 --> 15:06.160 and then more contributors of servo, like WPT, something we talked about before a little in the 15:06.160 --> 15:11.840 morning, is the web platform test, this shared test suite that all the web engines run, 15:12.480 --> 15:18.960 it has like more than two million sub tests these days, and growing, and basically servo 15:18.960 --> 15:24.720 out of things, WPT and both directions, like when there is new tests on WPT, we don't load them, 15:25.680 --> 15:31.200 when there is changes on the test on servo, we upload them upstream, that's why all the engines, 15:31.200 --> 15:38.480 what other engines also do, and since the beginning we have this both running, I mean probably not the first year, 15:38.480 --> 15:45.120 that's very still, that has already landed more than, I mean, for 150 pRs, on WPT, 15:45.120 --> 15:51.680 last year only we landed more than 250 pRs, on WPT, so those are improvements from the servo community 15:51.760 --> 16:04.160 to the whole WPT repository, and that's like, improvement for basically all the engines at the end, 16:04.160 --> 16:08.880 because maybe we find this using other engines to pass, or we increase the coverage there, 16:09.600 --> 16:15.120 and not only that, we also, for example, have to help with the infrastructure storing WPT, 16:15.120 --> 16:21.680 FYI, this website to check the results, that we migrate the Docker image to the next version of 16:21.680 --> 16:25.680 Ubuntu, because that was needed for some of our dependencies, and that was for everybody, 16:25.680 --> 16:30.560 but only for servo. And then, of course, there are also impact on the standard, 16:30.560 --> 16:35.520 you're implementing a new feature, and you are finding issues, it doesn't matter where you implement it, 16:35.520 --> 16:39.360 if it's in Chrome, if it's in server, but especially if you're implementing everything from scratch, 16:39.440 --> 16:45.440 you will find more issues, even, you will find gaps on the specs, you will find lack of clarity in many 16:45.440 --> 16:50.400 parts, and at the end, you're going to be reporting them, you're going to be contributing to those 16:50.400 --> 16:57.760 expectations, and making the specs more clear for everyone, maybe ending up having to fix some 16:57.760 --> 17:02.800 issues on different engines, things to that, and not all of them on the new engines, so yeah, 17:02.800 --> 17:07.760 they're having a lot of issues filled, and the discussions on CSS, HTML, Dom, Fets, 17:07.840 --> 17:13.280 what driver, I mean, everything you implement at the end is likely you need to clarify the 17:13.280 --> 17:18.640 spec or improve it. There are some cool examples of these, like the session history, 17:18.640 --> 17:26.080 it was a long, standing issue on HTML, in the sense that the what was in the spec was not what 17:26.080 --> 17:30.800 any end was implementing, some implementations were doing something different that was was in the spec, 17:31.600 --> 17:37.040 and there was a paper by Connor Bistolang, Alan Jeffrey, that we're working on servo, 17:37.680 --> 17:43.520 16, where they were writing this paper, explaining all these models, how this could be solved 17:43.520 --> 17:49.520 for the web, and how this could be a good solution, at the end that helped to solve that, 17:49.520 --> 17:55.360 HTML use it with all that research, on servo and all that, it helped to solve it, and now the 17:55.360 --> 18:01.760 spec is clear, and everyone follows the thing of that. Similar things, like CSS tables, 18:01.760 --> 18:09.600 having with us, since ever on the web, right, I mean, like the first website, what is in CSS tables, 18:09.600 --> 18:15.440 everywhere, and we were implemented in CSS tables, in the last couple of years, 18:16.320 --> 18:23.040 in the layout 2020, engines of the new engine from scratch, and we found multiple 18:23.040 --> 18:29.280 interop issues. CSS have tables, I've never had a good spec, and that causes a lot of 18:29.360 --> 18:33.600 interop issues, and we have been reporting them, and you can see examples here that, 18:34.320 --> 18:41.840 the rendering of some test cases look very different on bling, then work it's servo, 18:41.840 --> 18:45.840 and get going one case, by in the other case, each of them is different, in the other case, 18:45.840 --> 18:52.480 servo matches link and not get, because a lot of interop issues are nice to be sorted out, 18:52.480 --> 18:59.040 and because that improved the web platform for everyone else. So trying to get some conclusions 18:59.040 --> 19:04.560 from this, like new web engines help the wider web platform ecosystem is not the only useful 19:04.560 --> 19:09.760 for themselves, at the end, you contribute to more, way more things, you improve the web for everyone, 19:10.720 --> 19:16.480 they improve the specs, they help identify interop issues, they increase the test coverage, 19:16.480 --> 19:22.240 they cover many corner cases that were not covered before, they can find bugs in other engines, 19:23.200 --> 19:30.320 and they also provide new ways to use the web, which is also very useful, and help with 19:30.320 --> 19:36.320 the problem we have these days, that is the lack of diversity on the web, which can also help with, 19:36.320 --> 19:42.240 I mean, we have a more diverse web, we will have also, that will be better for everyone, 19:42.240 --> 19:48.320 more inclusive web, and help your platform for everyone, and these days, it's like, 19:48.320 --> 19:56.080 kind of getting more complex, that's so, yeah, it's very useful, and just last few slides, 19:56.080 --> 20:02.160 if you want to join the project, I mean, all the code is in GitHub, if you are curious about 20:02.160 --> 20:06.960 the rest, or you have some rational edge, I want to learn about how it is to develop our web 20:06.960 --> 20:12.560 engine, you can join us, you can come to the solid chat where, and the whole community is, 20:12.560 --> 20:19.360 what are the discussions happening, here you can email us a servo director, and then, of course, 20:19.360 --> 20:25.520 we are very thankful to all this sponsor, we have a lot of individual sponsors and some organizations, 20:25.520 --> 20:30.320 that are the native money to the project, GitHub and open collective, that's very useful, 20:30.320 --> 20:37.520 we are using that money, mostly for the CI, basically continuous integration, running all the tests, 20:37.520 --> 20:42.880 and all that, we have some self-hosted runners that we can have, thank you to this money, 20:42.880 --> 20:47.120 and that have to speed up a lot of time for the developer working on the project, 20:47.120 --> 20:52.240 we are also using that money to sponsor time from just Matios, one of the long-term contributors 20:52.240 --> 20:57.440 to the project that is helping new contributors to join the project, providing hints and guidance 20:57.440 --> 21:02.880 and to interviews, and yeah, we are looking to keep growing the project, growing the community 21:02.880 --> 21:11.280 around it, and to make this happen, and it continues for a long term, and even if you are not 21:11.280 --> 21:15.200 so deep interest, and you don't want to add so deep into web engine development, you can have 21:15.200 --> 21:21.200 the project also by testing it, you can go to the website, download it, it has, I mean, you can run it 21:21.200 --> 21:26.160 on the five platforms, you can report issues, participate in the discussions and GitHub, 21:26.160 --> 21:31.440 basically, play with a project, let us know your experience, how things are going, that's always 21:31.520 --> 21:45.760 very useful, and thank you everyone, you can follow us on this URL, social channels, 21:45.760 --> 21:52.160 I'm of course doing the talk with Shareboy itself, I didn't say before, but this is using 21:52.160 --> 22:00.000 cerebral, this is like, awesome, so we have about five minutes for some questions, if there 22:00.000 --> 22:15.280 are any, okay, I'm curious if there's any effort to keep the API at all similar to web case, 22:16.240 --> 22:23.360 yeah, I will repeat the question, they are asking if there are any effort to keep the API similar 22:23.360 --> 22:29.360 to the one in WebKit, it's not that, I mean, we are starting to draft the API, missing a 22:30.080 --> 22:36.320 getting to a point that many things can be done already, we are following it, basing it on what 22:36.320 --> 22:41.840 WebKit has, I don't know if it's going to be like very similar or not, but I mean, like the idea is 22:41.920 --> 22:48.000 try to cover what work it is used by many people to do applications, if we can have a similar API, 22:48.000 --> 22:52.880 we will have a good one, so that's why we are following it, but yeah, I mean, maybe it's not 22:52.880 --> 22:58.400 exactly the same or not, I mean, we are still not, we in the next few months we are going to have 22:58.400 --> 23:04.000 like the first kind of release of the API, then of course it's going to iterate, but the first 23:04.000 --> 23:16.320 alpha release and then we will see where we can go. I may be wrong, but I thought that the originally 23:16.320 --> 23:23.120 server will start it as a project to replace Kekko in Firefox, are there any plans to again 23:23.120 --> 23:30.400 to join Firefox? I mean, that's, I don't really know how it was started in Mozilla, maybe there 23:30.480 --> 23:35.280 are some one here, I'm sorry to that, I don't know what were the initial plans that Mozilla, 23:35.280 --> 23:40.640 I guess the long-term plan was that maybe eventually it will replace Kekko, at this point, I mean, 23:40.640 --> 23:45.680 we will be happy, of course, if Firefox is server was rendering engine, but I guess it's more 23:45.680 --> 23:50.240 up to Mozilla to decide if they want to try that or not, of course. I didn't suggest that question, 23:50.240 --> 23:55.680 it's wrong, I work from it, yeah, and so it was really a 90 project and we are already 23:55.760 --> 24:00.800 using a lot of part of server, so if you look at web render, style, and some other pieces, 24:01.600 --> 24:06.880 it's already already collaborating a lot with a server project on those pieces, so we don't have any 24:06.880 --> 24:12.000 plan to replace Kekko by server, because we think that there are a lot of work to do with web 24:12.000 --> 24:17.440 contact and so on, but if the quality is good, maybe in one day, the founder is not part of any plan. 24:19.120 --> 24:24.480 That would be great for sure, of course. That would be a great success story for sure, if I 24:24.480 --> 24:31.200 thought I was a lot of shit. All right, I think we're good. Oh, we have another question. 24:37.200 --> 24:43.680 So, server will recently adopted a version release process, has that had any noticeable 24:43.680 --> 24:50.720 noticeable effects on your development process? So far, we are just exploring it, I mean, starting 24:50.720 --> 24:56.720 to have some releases every month, basically, to try to see how that works, try to have a release process 24:56.720 --> 25:02.800 that at least works. And we are exploring with it, I guess, soon, maybe in one two months, we can 25:02.800 --> 25:08.240 release a single one, but it's not going to mean anything special, other than, okay, the release process 25:08.240 --> 25:12.960 is working for us, we can start doing releases. I think that's going to be useful for people that are 25:12.960 --> 25:18.960 playing with it to have a release, you can use and all that, so that's why we are exploring that. 25:21.440 --> 25:27.680 When the fact that the guy got to be fully compatible with other major engines, I mean, 25:27.680 --> 25:34.480 he used that there I still some work to do, some APs to implement, some gaps to fill, 25:34.480 --> 25:38.320 when they expect to, the major part of that work to be done. 25:39.920 --> 25:44.160 Hi, that's a very hard question to answer, because we're incompatible, I mean, like, 25:44.720 --> 25:51.600 there are many, many different things missing, and you can get to one point, but it's going to be 25:51.600 --> 25:56.240 new features here out there, so it's really hard, but maybe for some use cases, it's already 25:56.240 --> 26:00.800 good enough, that's the question. If you need this, just this murder-down viewer, maybe it's 26:00.800 --> 26:05.600 good enough, what servo can do, this day is to render Macdown, you don't need another more 26:05.600 --> 26:11.760 complex engine, maybe, and that can save you. Perfect, thank you so much. Thank you, 26:11.760 --> 26:15.360 you're a huge round of applause for Manille. Thank you.